Poppular Videogame to Become Movie? High Risk of a Flop...

[TokuNoob]

Shadow of the Colossus is in my humble opinion one of the greatest games of all time. The game mechanics, the environment, the creature designs and the story were all unique and hugely original. Now four years after the game's release, Sony, the company that brought us the game, has announced a feature film cited for release in 2012.

Upon hearing this news I was both excited, and concerned. The risk of the film tarnishing the game, and becoming lost amongst such cult classics as "Double Dragon" and "Super Mario Bros" is exceedingly present. This is my prime concern, and indeed multiple internet pages have already counted the film out.

So this is where I step in to annoy you guys with my completely sense-of-duty driven forum thread asking fellow forum goers to support the upcoming film should it come out. Yes, I know who's involved, and I'll just tell you guys right away that the chances of this film being completely wretched amongst the stark contrast of digital eye candy is great, and I'm not expecting this film to set any legends.

Okay, so the film isn't going to be the best, and probably relly heavily on CGI. The core elements that made the game "Shadow of the Colossus" so poppular only work for a game and probably won't work out well for a movie. These are definitely concern areas, but to me it just doesn't matter. I don't know how many of you guys out there have played the game (if any at all), but it is a wonderful title, that I don't wish to see tarnished by a flop at the box office.

So many movies have flopped lately such as "Eragon" and "Street Fighter: the Legend of Chun-Li". But for all of their shortcomings they aren't bad movies, and certainly don't deserve the label. I'm tired of seeing big-budgeted films flop, and would encourage most everyone out there to just loosen up and have fun with it. Like another forum poster had stated in a previous entry, anything can sound stupid or foolish depending on how you view it. I'm simply asking that you guys go out, see the new Shadow of the Colossus and try to enjoy it, and perhaps make the film a surprise hit (the forum goers here aren't the only I'll preach to). Who knows, maybe if you convince yourselves your having a good time, and walk into with the same enthusiasm as we all did the Kamen Rider franchise, we all might enjoy ourselves for a change.

[Tendou]

I have to say that the key reasons why a video game based movie doesn't succeed is because of the writing staff first and foremost and then due to the guys at the top.

There is little to no creativity when these writers write the script. They tend to try and stick to what the game has in it and they don't go any further. No one game(excluding Metal Gear Solid Franchise) has enough material to make a decent plot for a movie. Nowadays you see a lot of the bigger games have novels and a whole expanded universe supporting them. Games like Halo, Gears of War, Mass Effect and many others have many novels and other material that expands the universe.

As for the guys at top they tend to play it safe. They are sometimes the ones that urge the writers to just stick to the game's plot and not expand it. They want to make money not do the game justice.

In order to make a good video game based movie there needs to be an expanded universe for the game. That EU needs to be implemented in the script heavily in order to give more substance. Also it needs to be treated seriously. Not just like some B action flick. There needs to be decent characters that are well developed and a very immersive plot. Also in my opinion the most important piece is that the developers need to be heavily involved as well as the publisher of the game.

The one game that I see making the best transition to the big screen is Halo. Out of all the current popular games on the market Halo due to the novels, games and many other sources has the single most well developed story. There is so much material to use that it would be easy to make a decent script. Also both Bungie and Microsoft have already shown how involved they would be with the project. All of the amazing live action Halo commericals are their attempts at showing that making a movie for this game is possible. Also Microsoft was actually willing to pay for almost the whole movie.

As for Shadow of the Colossus I played the game and thought it was massive in scope and was a great experience. I think that if they do what I said above then it will be a great movie. I do believe that it will be good. I doubt they would want to waste money on a flop. The other video game inspired movies cost very little to make, but this one I would assume would cost a pretty penny.(I think that is the phrase) I would definitely see this movie upon release. I usually have high hopes about these types of movies.

[TokuNoob]

Several good points, Tendou. Good to know someone actually agrees with me out there. But the budget was actually part of the concern to the web pages that had already counted Colossus out. If they were to feature all of the spectacle of the game, it would be on a par to James Cameron's Avatar as far as budget. (Then again I have seen much accomplished on a meager budget...) I can only imagine that the number of 16 in-game Colossi would be close to halved, and strangely I don't have a problem with this. And even if the movie fails to live up to the game as far as the in-game sense of desolation, it could at least make up for by exploring an aforementioned expanded universe. The desolation feel probably would fail in a movie anyway because the audience isn't directly involved like in a videogame. The potential for greatness is there. Thanks, Tendou, for pointing that out.

Also, as you probably already know District 9 was the result of the production team that had already been asembled for a Halo live-action flick, before the company pulled out. It was recently listed by IGN as one of the films in development hell right alongside Jurassic Park IV. The difference is that Microsoft seems to have enough faith in Halo to try and draw more attention to it.

Anyway, thanks for the good word.

[Gerbil the Sinner]

So many movies have flopped lately such as "Eragon" and "Street Fighter: the Legend of Chun-Li". But for all of their shortcomings they aren't bad movies, and certainly don't deserve the label.

...But those ARE bad movies. The Inheritance Cycle pretty much uses every fantasy cliche that ever existed (not to mention copying other, better works) and the Eragon film was a WORSE version of the already terrible book. Street Fighter: The Legend of Chun Li not only had little ties to the source material (while being a genuinely bad story on top of that) but it wasn't even big budgeted, rendering your next point unusual when using this as one of your examples.

[Tendou]

...But those ARE bad movies. The Inheritance Cycle pretty much uses every fantasy cliche that ever existed (not to mention copying other, better works) and the Eragon film was a WORSE version of the already terrible book. Street Fighter: The Legend of Chun Li not only had little ties to the source material (while being a genuinely bad story on top of that, but it wasn't even big budgeted, rendering your next point unusual when using this as one of your examples.

I personally enjoy the Inheritance Cycle. It definitely is not original, but it is a good read for me. You are right about both films though.

[Gerbil the Sinner]

In order to make a good video game based movie there needs to be an expanded universe for the game. That EU needs to be implemented in the script heavily in order to give more substance. Also it needs to be treated seriously. Not just like some B action flick. There needs to be decent characters that are well developed and a very immersive plot. Also in my opinion the most important piece is that the developers need to be heavily involved as well as the publisher of the game.

Explain what you define as EU.

[Tendou]

Explain what you define as EU.

EU=Expanded Universe

Novels, comics and other sources of material outside of the game that expand upon said game's universe.

[TokuNoob]

I meant not bad in terms of production value. "Eragon" certainly could've been better, but I think the studio wanted to aim for a more child friendly film. As for the books being unoriginal, with as many stories that have been made I would find it hard to find anything original these days. While with the Inheritance Cycle comparisons to such works as Dragon Riders of Pern, Lord of the Rings and (most infamously) Star Wars, it at least makes for some enjoyable story telling. I haven't seen Chun Li yet (nor am I likely to), so I really can't say, but alot of films deemed as bad I personally enjoyed (Deep Rising; definitely a guilty pleasure :)). I'd have to say that the difference between good or bad (with today's films anyway) really depends on the viewer. But I would have to say movies like Manos: the Hands of Fate, really do suck. If you haven't seen it yet, but your curious, buy it as a part of Myster Science Theater 3000.

[Gerbil the Sinner]

EU=Expanded Universe

I know. I asked what you defined as Expanded Universe.

Novels, comics and other sources of material outside of the game that expand upon said game's universe.But why is that necessary and not, say, introducing new plot elements specifically for a film?

Sorry for the double post. But I couldn't pass this up.

I meant not bad in terms of production value. "Eragon" certainly could've been better, but I think the studio wanted to aim for a more child friendly film. As for the books being unoriginal, with as many stories that have been made I would find it hard to find anything original these days.

That excuse is shit.

"There have been a lot of stories, so I'll just settle with derivative crap."

Stories can be original while having concepts not entirely original. It's about how the ideas are implemented.

While with the Inheritance Cycle comparisons to such works as Dragon Riders of Pern, Lord of the Rings and (most infamously) Star Wars, it at least makes for some enjoyable story telling.If you like really crappy, overly flowery, ugly purple prose and shitty characterization, then sure. It's really enjoyable.

I haven't seen Chun Li yet (nor am I likely to), so I really can't say, but alot of films deemed as bad I personally enjoyed (Deep Rising; definitely a guilty pleasure :)). I'd have to say that the difference between good or bad (with today's films anyway) really depends on the viewer.Quality =/= preference. Just because you like something doesn't make it good. I like the original Power Rangers, but it's a shitty show.

Things can have quality that can't be disputed. Preference, however, is up to the individual.

But I would have to say movies like Manos: the Hands of Fate, really do suck. If you haven't seen it yet, but your curious, buy it as a part of Myster Science Theater 3000.Nice way to contradict yourself there.

MOD ACTION: DO NOT DOUBLE POST, EDIT YOUR FUCKING POSTS

[TokuNoob]

Okay, fine. Point taken. Touche'. But then what? Is it a bad movie if a Shadow of the Colossus film strays from the source material. It would be I Am Legend set a sword and sorcery setting with no hope of success because Will Smith wouldn't be in it. Or is it a case of an unfilmable story? I have to admit that I've thought about a Shadow of the Colossus movie before and decided that it should just be left as is (a game!).

Like I posted previously, the idea of having a big deserted land scape wouldn't work for a film, because the audience wouldn't be directly involved. I suppose they could try and make up for this in some area, and they do have the game Ico to fall back on in the case of an expanded universe. Other than that it seems to me Shadow of the Colossus is a bit of a risk. Remember, I walked into this thread expecting it to underperform (if it's even released theatrically).

If you were trying to come up with something original you would just have to take a previously presented concept in a new direction. If it were to be truly original, well I have no idea. :(

Oh, and by the way, I forgot to say welcome to the board.

[Tendou]

I know. I asked what you defined as Expanded Universe.



But why is that necessary and not, say, introducing new plot elements specifically for a film?

The reason why I believe that EU material is necessary is due to most games not having decent stories in terms of movies. You could always introduce new plot materials and that is what I am getting at. I think the EU needs to be there as a base for the writers to expand upon. If you give the writers nothing to work with they can't craft anything good. The writers need a lot of material to work with in order to create new material that still adheres to the game's universe.

I don't think a movie should ever just be about the events that took place in the EU of said game. There is no point in just redoing a story that is already done unless it is horrible of course.

[Gerbil the Sinner]

Okay, fine. Point taken. Touche'. But then what? Is it a bad movie if a Shadow of the Colossus film strays from the source material.

Um. No.

I never implied that, either.

It would be I Am Legend set a sword and sorcery setting with no hope of success because Will Smith wouldn't be in it.

Except the story of Shadow of the Colossus is NOTHING like I Am Legend behind very, very few superficial similarities (or a core similarity; one man with an animal-like companion alone battling monsters) that are implemented in completely different ways.

Or is it a case of an unfilmable story?

...It's basically one giant monster movie.

I have to admit that I've thought about a Shadow of the Colossus movie before and decided that it should just be left as is (a game!).

In it's original state, maybe. But the core concept could easily be turned into a movie with modifications to fit the medium.

Like I posted previously, the idea of having a big deserted land scape wouldn't work for a film, because the audience wouldn't be directly involved.

People can't be interested in large, beautiful landscapes? What constitutes as "directly involved" to you?

I suppose they could try and make up for this in some area, and they do have the game Ico to fall back on in the case of an expanded universe.

Or they could just create story elements for the movie.

Other than that it seems to me Shadow of the Colossus is a bit of a risk. Remember, I walked into this thread expecting it to underperform (if it's even released theatrically).

Um. Okay.

If you were trying to come up with something original you would just have to take a previously presented concept in a new direction. If it were to be truly original, well I have no idea. :(

You're...not even saying anything here. I don't understand what this has to do with ANYTHING.

Oh, and by the way, I forgot to say welcome to the board.

Thank you.

The reason why I believe that EU material is necessary is due to most games not having decent stories in terms of movies. You could always introduce new plot materials and that is what I am getting at. I think the EU needs to be there as a base for the writers to expand upon. If you give the writers nothing to work with they can't craft anything good.

You don't know that and that claim is completely baseless.

[Tendou]

You don't know that and that claim is completely baseless.

Actually I get this notion from movies like Street Fighter, Doom, Super Mario Bros. and pretty much anything done by Uwe Boll pertaining to video games. Each and everyone of these movies suffer from bad plots among other things. Due to the recurring trend in this when it comes to video game movies it is fair to say that the writers can't create a cohesive script. Plus if you look at these movies one problem is that none of them have any movie story worthy material.

Street Fighter is just a bunch of people fighting in the streets. They added in a "story" just for a way for players to progress through the game and ultimately extend replay value.

Doom is another game that has a typical FPS story. Nothing special nor deep nor complex nor anything else about it. Great game though for its time.

I don't think I even need to state the lack of story in Super Mario Bros.

I think these are fair observations based on recurring trends. That is one reason why there is such reluctance in actually creating these movies in Hollywood. We'll have to see how Prince of Persia and God of War do story wise since these seem to be the closest to release.(Prince of Persia is actually underway. Don't know about the status of God of War.)

[Gerbil the Sinner]

Actually I get this notion from movies like Street Fighter, Doom, Super Mario Bros. and pretty much anything done by Uwe Boll pertaining to video games. Each and everyone of these movies suffer from bad plots among other things. Due to the recurring trend in this when it comes to video game movies it is fair to say that the writers can't create a cohesive script. Plus if you look at these movies one problem is that none of them have any movie story worthy material.

Oh this will be delightful.

Street Fighter is just a bunch of people fighting in the streets. They added in a "story" just for a way for players to progress through the game and ultimately extend replay value.

Funny thing? Street Fighter DOES have Expanded Universe fiction in the form of backstory explained through guidebooks, comics, cartoons, etc.

By your logic, the second Street Fighter film (Legend of Chun Li) would be good because the writers have a lot to work with.

The presence of Expanded Universe fiction of any kind does NOT guarantee success or a good story. Good writing does. You're lumping a bunch of potentially talented individuals and potentially good films together just because you think people are instantly talentless if they have to use creativity.

You don't know what you're talking about. The fact you think Street Fighter proves your point when it, in fact, DISPROVES it shows this.

Doom is another game that has a typical FPS story. Nothing special nor deep nor complex nor anything else about it. Great game though for its time.

Doom was a bad movie because it was a bad movie. The game is a perfect template for an action movie. Adding characterization and storytelling that's at bare bones competency isn't something that requires a comic book or novel that happens to be in the same franchise.

I don't think I even need to state the lack of story in Super Mario Bros.

An early draft of the script had heavier use of elements from the game combined with movie original elements...that, for the most part, worked. You can find the script online if you look hard enough.

A lot of movies can get fucked over. It's a nature of production. It's also wrong to blame everything on a few writers tossing their hands in the air and saying "If only we had a game to adapt that had comics and books that tell us what to write!"

I think these are fair observations based on recurring trends.

No. These are over exaggerated observations based on a history of adaptations of works that are, for the most part, inherently plotless. You don't even BOTHER to take into account that modern video games do put at least the bare minimum effort in to create a storyline for their games.

That is one reason why there is such reluctance in actually creating these movies in Hollywood.

They didn't profit because they were bad movies. They were bad movies because the scripts were awful. The scripts were awful for any number of reasons...a lack of fiction penned in other mediums isn't something to blame.

Here's a thought. Did the first ever Expanded Universe writer for, say, Super Mario Brothers have anything to work with? Did the first Street Fighter EU writer have anything to work with beyond the core game? If THEY didn't...why would their work be required for a movie, which is technically Expanded Universe fiction.

We'll have to see how Prince of Persia and God of War do story wise since these seem to be the closest to release.(Prince of Persia is actually underway. Don't know about the status of God of War.)

I love how you're comparing games that had cutscenes and active plots to movies based on games that had no active plots.

[TokuNoob]

Adding characterization and storytelling that's at bare bones competency isn't something that requires a comic book or novel that happens to be in the same franchise.




For once I agree. Mortal Kombat did alright as a movie, but it had no EU (and if it did, no company bothered looking at it).